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The place to talk Marshall University sports! => HerdFans => Topic started by: miltonherdfan on July 27, 2017, 12:10:14 AM
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http://www.herald-dispatch.com/sports/marshall_sports/terrence-thompson-leaving-marshall-men-s-hoops-program/article_de577ee8-d132-541b-950b-2d2819ab4bf0.html
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Does this "speak" to anyone that Iran B. will be eligible ?
( you know ol' p2m - commies under every bed ) :-[
p2m
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I doubt they know yet. But i could see Thompson opting out if Bennett gets eligible. Bennett was throwing him around pretty easily in practices. BTW Bennett has lost 25 lbs since he got here.
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I doubt they know yet. But i could see Thompson opting out if Bennett gets eligible. Bennett was throwing him around pretty easily in practices. BTW Bennett has lost 25 lbs since he got here.
Good job by Bennett. That should put him at around 325, right? Was hoping DD could red shirt Bennett, but with Thompson's decision to leave looks like Bennett plays if eligible.
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Good job by Bennett. That should put him at around 325, right? Was hoping DD could red shirt Bennett, but with Thompson's decision to leave looks like Bennett plays if eligible.
Danny has said all along that the day Iran becomes eligible is the day he plays. He will NOT red shirt him. Only Darius will red shirt.
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If Darius is that good play him. You can't count on really good players sticking around 5 years anymore. They can declare or transfer that last year if they want too. If Darius is a stud CUSA RS junior, he could say go play his final year at Duke or something. It's a great risk to RS the really good players these days.
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If Darius is that good play him. You can't count on really good players sticking around 5 years anymore. They can declare or transfer that last year if they want too. If Darius is a stud CUSA RS junior, he could say go play his final year at Duke or something. It's a great risk to RS the really good players these days.
Your thinking is correct, but Danny has been pretty adamant about letting him grow into his frame. He is VERY thin.
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So is Lonzo Ball rail thin. That thin stuff is overrated. If you are a scorer you are going to score.
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You can either significantly contribute now or not. That should be the test.
While the practice guys would know better than me, if Darius can outperform either Williams or Mijovic or Koljanin (and I am not saying that is the case), it would be folly to redshirt Darius, especially with us now being a frontcourt player down.
Randy Noll and Jeff Guthrie and Jeff Richardson and Rodney Holden were not beefy weightlifters. All four played very effectively at about 6-7 to 6-9, 200 to 220 pounds. Darius is listed on the roster at 6-7, 190, so lets put 10 pounds on him and get him ready to go if he can help us this year.
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I would say 190 is very kind. I would guess about 170. But i don't have a problem with him playing at all. But i would rather see a redshirt.
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You can either significantly contribute now or not. That should be the test.
While the practice guys would know better than me, if Darius can outperform either Williams or Mijovic or Koljanin (and I am not saying that is the case), it would be folly to redshirt Darius, especially with us now being a frontcourt player down.
Randy Noll and Jeff Guthrie and Jeff Richardson and Rodney Holden were not beefy weightlifters. All four played very effectively at about 6-7 to 6-9, 200 to 220 pounds. Darius is listed on the roster at 6-7, 190, so lets put 10 pounds on him and get him ready to go if he can help us this year.
Different time. Different game. You can't compare that with the way the game has changed nowadays. Too many big men that are truly big. Darius as he is now would never see the paint because he has no muscle to work anyone inside. He'd be a front court player that spends all his time in the back court. It isn't worth wasting a year of eligibility for only half the skill set to be used effectively. The kid has a very high bball IQ and executes things perfectly, but that only goes so far.
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If Darius is not get good enough to be a meaningful contributor this year, so be it. But, sorry, I would take any of the guys I mentioned today.
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Different time. Different game. You can't compare that with the way the game has changed nowadays. Too many big men that are truly big. Darius as he is now would never see the paint because he has no muscle to work anyone inside. He'd be a front court player that spends all his time in the back court. It isn't worth wasting a year of eligibility for only half the skill set to be used effectively. The kid has a very high bball IQ and executes things perfectly, but that only goes so far.
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Yeah, but you can't tell me that at least 3 of those guys mentioned by PBIII couldn't do very well in DD's system. All but Holden had good outside shots for "big" men. And I think Rodney Holden would play just by the way he battled on the interior and fought for rebounds, despite his lack of "bulk". I think guys like Noll, like George Stone before him, and Guthrie would have loved the 3 point line. Maybe it was around in Jeff's time, but not for Randy and George.
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Just in the last few years we had a thin rebounding machine and good defensive inside player in Dennis Tinnon and his first year at MU he played around 212-215. His last year playing at the juco his weight was around 200 from what the juco coach told me.
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Tinnon looked like he was a good 20 pounds heavier than Darius. I could be wrong I just know what we've been up against and the struggle for rebounds on both sides of the floor.
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Tinnon looked like he was a good 20 pounds heavier than Darius. I could be wrong I just know what we've been up against and the struggle for rebounds on both sides of the floor.
I agree with you because Darius looks like he weighs no more than 180 and he needs mature muscle and that's why RS would be good for him. Dennis was like a RS junior with mature muscle for his weight since he worked in a meat packing plant before deciding to continue his education. Darius as you know is fresh out of high school. Randy and Guthrie were juniors when they played at MU so they fall into the same muscle build as Dennis--thin body, but if we saw them as true FR they probably looked like Darius does this year.
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. Darius is listed on the roster at 6-7, 190, so lets put 10 pounds on him and get him ready to go if he can help us this year.
He is no where near 190.
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If i had to guess and put money on it. I would say 170. If he has to play this year that is fine with me. But i would like to see a RS if possible. IMO the kid will be the future face of the program and that includes Bennett (and i am big time high on Bennett).
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Just quoting HerdZone.com. ;D
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Just quoting HerdZone.com. ;D
Herdzone like every college media outlet, inflates sizes of players in every sport
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Herdzone like every college media outlet, inflates sizes of players in every sport
HM, please tell me that Herdzone has inflated Iran's weight as well!! ;D
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HM, please tell me that Herdzone has inflated Iran's weight as well!! ;D
I understand you may be joking, but a different post yesterday indicated Bennett's weight is down 25lbs since he arrived on campus.
He would be an incredible force for the Herd at 300lbs, which means he would have to lose another 25. (if his arrival weight was accurately reported at 350).
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I was told by one of the basketball staff he has lost 25 lbs
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Herdzone like every college media outlet, inflates sizes of players in every sport
Then I guess the weights of Randy Noll, Jeff Guthrie, Jeff Richardson, Rodney Holden, and George Stone were also inflated.
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They all try and squeeze another inch out of a player and a few pounds. I alwaysheard Charles Barkley was about 6 4 1/2 -6 5" at most but was always listed 6 6". All schools do it
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They all try and squeeze another inch out of a player and a few pounds. I alwaysheard Charles Barkley was about 6 4 1/2 -6 5" at most but was always listed 6 6". All schools do it
Yes they do for sure. I remember back in the early 70's when the Herd had the special season and was paying attention to the NBA draft to see where Russell Lee would go. The Lakers drafted a 7-1 center ( i think from a school in KY but not UK or Louisville), anyway his college size was 7-1 but the NBA listed height 6-9 1/2 .
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Just guessing Yogi, could that have been Jim McDaniels from WKU?
TRS
MU 71
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Just guessing Yogi, could that have been Jim McDaniels from WKU?
I am thinking it was Travis Grant from Kentucky State.
TRS
MU 71
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I remember the name Travis Grant but I just can't remember much about him.
TRS
MU 71
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Couldn't have been a big player from KY by the name of Thomas Paine, could it? Back in late 60s, he was a high school hot shot in that state, about 7'0". MU under Coach Ellis Johnson tried to recruit him. KY and Adolph Rupp was after him hard because of pressure to recruit a black player to UK at that time. Believe he signed with the Wildcats but got convicted of rape before he had any kind of basketball career. A waste of talent, for sure.
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I remember the name Travis Grant but I just can't remember much about him.
TRS
MU 71
I think he was a 6-7 forward from Kentucky State(div 2?) that averaged 40 points per game. I think you might be right about McDaniels but for some reason i thought the name was like Elmore Webster or something like that. That's quite a while back so trying to remember the names makes it a major exam!!! :-\
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Google is great. Elmore Smith was a 7 foot center from Kentucky state. He was the 3rd pick in 1971 draft. Russell Lee was drafted in 1972.
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Couldn't have been a big player from KY by the name of Thomas Paine, could it? Back in late 60s, he was a high school hot shot in that state, about 7'0". MU under Coach Ellis Johnson tried to recruit him. KY and Adolph Rupp was after him hard because of pressure to recruit a black player to UK at that time. Believe he signed with the Wildcats but got convicted of rape before he had any kind of basketball career. A waste of talent, for sure.
Ellis did recruit Tom Paine and he visited MU. I walked into the original Varsity (Jack Riggs) one summer's evening and he was in the bar drinking beer with Ed Ratlleff who went to the NBA via Long Beach State and played for Jerry Tarkanian. There was also a guard named Lonnie Bush with them, not sure if that was his name since it a long time ago. I bought them some Strohs which was a NCAA violation LOL. Paine was a nice guy and the Bush kid kept telling me to remember his name because he was going to a big time player. Bush was smoking Kools most of the evening. The only reason those guys were hanging out at the Varsity I think can of, was they were being recruited by Ellis?
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Google is great. Elmore Smith was a 7 foot center from Kentucky state. He was the 3rd pick in 1971 draft. Russell Lee was drafted in 1972.
Well i went the google way and came up with this:
Travis Grant
Travis Grant
(Machine Gun, The Machine)
Position: Small Forward ▪ Shoots: Right
6-7, 215lb (201cm, 97kg)
Born: January 1, 1950 (Age: 67-211d) in Clayton, Alabama us
College: Kentucky State University
High School: Barbour County Training School in Clayton, Alabama
Draft: Los Angeles Lakers, 1st round (13th pick, 13th overall), 1972 NBA Draft
NBA Debut: October 11, 1972 ▪ ABA Debut: November 21, 1973
Elmore Smith
High school Ballard-Hudson (Macon, Georgia)
College Kentucky State (1968–1971)
NBA draft 1971 / Round: 1 / Pick: 3rd overall
Selected by the Buffalo Braves
Playing career 1971–1979
Position Center
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Ellis did recruit Tom Paine and he visited MU. I walked into the original Varsity (Jack Riggs) one summer's evening and he was in the bar drinking beer with Ed Ratlleff who went to the NBA via Long Beach State and played for Jerry Tarkanian. There was also a guard named Lonnie Bush with them, not sure if that was his name since it a long time ago. I bought them some Strohs which was a NCAA violation LOL. Paine was a nice guy and the Bush kid kept telling me to remember his name because he was going to a big time player. Bush was smoking Kools most of the evening. The only reason those guys were hanging out at the Varsity I think can of, was they were being recruited by Ellis?
Ellis not only recruited him but signed Paine (who reneged when Ellis was fired and his home state UK brought him in as there first ever African American BB signee) ...... Ellis was on the way to his best recruiting year ever.... Dwight Lamar and Roy Ebron (who passed away in Sept of 2014) were also on campus that year.............unfortunately Ellis was "re-assigned" following the football recruiting scandal when it was acknowledged that he was on NCAA probation for a recruiting "error" a small infraction at the time that involved an "illegal" contact with a recruit the previous year...(perhaps our most famous player of all time)
Just imagine, any of those names mentioned above (particularly Paine or Ebron) playing on the '72 team with Lee, D'Antoni, Collins, etc. That team's only weakness was at the 5 spot.
Now before anyone jumps forward and questions the validity of the Lamar/Ebron claim...... I had this conversation a number of years ago with Dwight "Bo" Lamar at a SW La (now UofL- Lafayette) game that I produced for ESPN and he was in attendance. We spoke for sometime about the MU v SW La NCAA game and his visit to Huntington with Ebron. And to add a little credibility to this story and to Flat Tire's, remember too that Lamar played for Columbus (O) East high school, his backcourt teammate was Ed Ratleff........ Ellis was "building" his dream!!! Ellis's dream was to win the National Championship at Marshall, he wanted to become the first person in history to have won a National Championship at every level of competition..... he played on a National Champion HS team and a National Champion College team at UK, he wanted to complete the "trifecta" and be the first to do it..... he may well have been on his way!!!!
Lamar went on to become the first (and only) player in NCAA history to lead the nation in scoring at the Division II and Division I levels as USL moved up while he was there.
Ellis wouldn't have had to signed them all, but imagine for a moment a backcourt with any combination of Mike D, Ty Collins, Bo Lamar, Ed Ratleff, Bill James....... and a center position with either Tom Paine (later a member of the Atlanta Hawks and sentenced to prison for rape in Atlanta) or Roy Ebron, instead of Barry Driscoll...... Ellis certainly would have had a chance at his "trifecta"!!!
USL was placed on NCAA probation not long after that season, primarily due to recruiting violations surrounding Lamar and Ebron, including Ebron winning a car dealer "drawing" for a new car shortly after arriving on campus.
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Good stuff Dan. I hadn't heard about Lamar and Ebron being recruited. Wow what a team that would have been. Thanks for the flash back.
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MU 71
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Good stuff Dan. I hadn't heard about Lamar and Ebron being recruited. Wow what a team that would have been. Thanks for the flash back.
TRS
MU 71
Another flash back. Wasn't it also thought that Russell Lee's brother Eugene would have been a good player for the Herd if he didn't have the motorcycle accident?
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Ellis not only recruited him but signed Paine (who reneged when Ellis was fired and his home state UK brought him in as there first ever African American BB signee) ...... Ellis was on the way to his best recruiting year ever.... Dwight Lamar and Roy Ebron (who passed away in Sept of 2014) were also on campus that year.............unfortunately Ellis was "re-assigned" following the football recruiting scandal when it was acknowledged that he was on NCAA probation for a recruiting "error" a small infraction at the time that involved an "illegal" contact with a recruit the previous year...(perhaps our most famous player of all time)
Just imagine, any of those names mentioned above (particularly Paine or Ebron) playing on the '72 team with Lee, D'Antoni, Collins, etc. That team's only weakness was at the 5 spot.
Now before anyone jumps forward and questions the validity of the Lamar/Ebron claim...... I had this conversation a number of years ago with Dwight "Bo" Lamar at a SW La (now UofL- Lafayette) game that I produced for ESPN and he was in attendance. We spoke for sometime about the MU v SW La NCAA game and his visit to Huntington with Ebron. And to add a little credibility to this story and to Flat Tire's, remember too that Lamar played for Columbus (O) East high school, his backcourt teammate was Ed Ratleff........ Ellis was "building" his dream!!! Ellis's dream was to win the National Championship at Marshall, he wanted to become the first person in history to have won a National Championship at every level of competition..... he played on a National Champion HS team and a National Champion College team at UK, he wanted to complete the "trifecta" and be the first to do it..... he may well have been on his way!!!!
Lamar went on to become the first (and only) player in NCAA history to lead the nation in scoring at the Division II and Division I levels as USL moved up while he was there.
Ellis wouldn't have had to signed them all, but imagine for a moment a backcourt with any combination of Mike D, Ty Collins, Bo Lamar, Ed Ratleff, Bill James....... and a center position with either Tom Paine (later a member of the Atlanta Hawks and sentenced to prison for rape in Atlanta) or Roy Ebron, instead of Barry Driscoll...... Ellis certainly would have had a chance at his "trifecta"!!!
USL was placed on NCAA probation not long after that season, primarily due to recruiting violations surrounding Lamar and Ebron, including Ebron winning a car dealer "drawing" for a new car shortly after arriving on campus.
Good recollection, dshoe. You're right about our "weakness" in the middle back in 71-72. In the NCAA loss to the Ragin Cajuns I believe that Bo Lamar had a good game but it was their big man, Ebron(?), who really hurt the Herd.
Ellis was really at the top of his game when it came to recruiting. Back then the NCAA rules were a lot different. I remember going to games out the old Field House when they would bring out the recruits to the middle of the floor at halftime and introduce them to the crowd. When they had Russell Lee, and others there, the crowd went nuts chanting for Lee to come to MU!! Crazy times, but electric, to be sure!
Another time, the Herd frosh team played a team from Lockbourne AFB in Columbus, OH. They had a 6'6" player named Weatherly, IIRC, who could really jump out of the gym. Word was he was about to leave the service and Ellis was wanting him badly; that was the main reason the game was scheduled. Believe dshoe correctly detailed Ellis' plan and that if we had had a President with a backbone who didn't spinelessly throw Ellis under the bus (Dr. Roland Nelson), that plan may have come to fruition!!!
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You are absolutely correct about Roland Nelson. >:(
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MU 71
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Another flash back. Wasn't it also thought that Russell Lee's brother Eugene would have been a good player for the Herd if he didn't have the motorcycle accident?
~ Played a lot of pool with Eugene and listened to a lot of music too in South Hall. I don't know if he graduated from MU or not.
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~ Played a lot of pool with Eugene and listened to a lot of music too in South Hall. I don't know if he graduated from MU or not.
Care to comment on how good Eugene Lee was supposed to be, or about the motorcycle injury that took him out of basketball?
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Too bad, that we didn't get Russell's little brother Ron Lee to play at MU. He was an All-American for Oregon and I seem to remember him being on the cover of Sports Illustrated.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Lee
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Back to the original topic . Has Thompson announced where he will transfer to ? I just found this https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bloggersodear.com/platform/amp/2017/7/30/16065474/wake-forest-basketball-potential-graduate-transfer-former-marshall-terrence-thompson-dinos-mitoglou
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Back to the original topic . Has Thompson announced where he will transfer to ? I just found this https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bloggersodear.com/platform/amp/2017/7/30/16065474/wake-forest-basketball-potential-graduate-transfer-former-marshall-terrence-thompson-dinos-mitoglou
No. In talking to Danny the other night he had no idea where he would end up. Pretty sure it will be in NC though.
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Care to comment on how good Eugene Lee was supposed to be, or about the motorcycle injury that took him out of basketball?
not anywhere near as good as Russell and Ron......he was part of the "package" to get Russell.
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Back to the original topic . Has Thompson announced where he will transfer to ? I just found this https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bloggersodear.com/platform/amp/2017/7/30/16065474/wake-forest-basketball-potential-graduate-transfer-former-marshall-terrence-thompson-dinos-mitoglou
Then one has to wonder with WF being a quality academic school in North Carolina with a medical school, I believe, (Bowman Gray?), and with Terrence being a North Carolinian with designs on going to medical school, that perhaps some kind of quid pro quo (hope my Latin is correct) is going on in this case??
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I'm more interested in who is going to end up here. With Thompson gone and the jury still out on Iran's eligibility we desperately need another body in the post.
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I'm more interested in who is going to end up here. With Thompson gone and the jury still out on Iran's eligibility we desperately need another body in the post.
If we don't fill that scholarship look for Danny to pull the red shirt off Darius
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If we don't fill that scholarship look for Danny to pull the red shirt off Darius
Hope the kid is ready, I just want us to be able to build off of last season but losing Taylor, Loop, Browning and now Thompson. I don't see how we do that based on what we've brought in at this moment.
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I've predicted all along Darius plays
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It would be nice to have Bennett or another post player. But if we don't I think we will still be pretty good and really fun to watch. This team is totally different than last years team. And I mean totally different. Defense is light years better. Quickness is much much better. Our guards especially Burks Watson and west can really put pressure on the ball. Think DD teams have played fast last couple years, just wait.
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It would be nice to have Bennett or another post player. But if we don't I think we will still be pretty good and really fun to watch. This team is totally different than last years team. And I mean totally different. Defense is light years better. Quickness is much much better. Our guards especially Burks Watson and west can really put pressure on the ball. Think DD teams have played fast last couple years, just wait.
I think Herdalum83's concern is with our lost experience. Especially now with loss of Thompson, which means we have lost the 2 top rebounders from last season, not an area where we were overly strong to begin with.
Its unreasonable to believe our guard pressure is going to force an exorbitant amount of turnovers EVERY game which will be the main factor on which the games will turn. Without Bennett, we will have Milan and a much improved (hopefully) Penava in the middle, so to speak. Juco forward should handle one other up front spot. Backups or those vying for other front court spot, or back up rolls, would include little used Bledsoe and inexperienced redshirt, Williams. This team is going into the preseason currently short on experience and front court depth, absent a late signee, or pulling someone's redshirt.
Right now, looks like we'll have more depth and overall quality in the backcourt but slightly less in same categories up front. May serve us well in most games, but against foes with a lot of good bigs, like those twin tower types at UTEP, we may struggle, unless we rain a lot of treys at about a 50 per cent clip!!
Going to be an interesting, and hopefully fun, season, Herd fans!!!
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I understand what you are saying. And i think we need another big to be really good. But people have to understand guys get a lot better from one year to the next especially under someone like Danny. Ryan Taylor wasn't what he was as a SR when he was a Freshman. Heck Peneva was nothing but "potential" at the beggining of last season. Skinny and had trouble even getting a rebound. Then he started having games of 14-18 pts and 7 rebs. Size is way over rated if you have a team that is smart quick and plays their positions well as a team. I don't know how many games this year team will win. But i do know that i am more excited about watching this team than any team DD has put on the floor yet. Watching Williams Koljanin and Pebeva continue to grow because of their potential and smarts. Also the guard play is going to be so exciting because we finally have guards tht can flat out defend. West is going to be good from day one. And i am really suprised how well Theineman is shooting the ball and playing. He may be the most improved player on the team. Not to mention the excitement i have for George and Bennett when they do get to play. Is it October yet?????
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It would be nice to have Bennett or another post player. But if we don't I think we will still be pretty good and really fun to watch. This team is totally different than last years team. And I mean totally different. Defense is light years better. Quickness is much much better. Our guards especially Burks Watson and west can really put pressure on the ball. Think DD teams have played fast last couple years, just wait.
I hope you're correct, but I remember the "practice attendees" raving about our improved defense LAST off-season... guys were quicker, faster, and better rebounders. We were going to benefit because James Kelly really wasn't that good on defense in 2015-16, and his replacement was going to be able to run, have long arms, and harass opponents. Truth is, we were below average on defense.
The talk last year was the vaunted press which, we were promised, Danny was going to install and play for 40 minutes/game. Then, after the season started and the press wasn't unveiled, it was said Danny was saving it for conference play. On and on. Truth is, we never really saw much of a press all year.
This year, the off-season talk is how much everyone has improved. But after one of the players who has improved so much decides to head to med school/transfer, we are advised it is not a problem.
Not that I don't enjoy your enthusiasm and practice reports, because I do. I'm just saying I'm gonna take a wait and see approach with the Herd after losing seniors Kelly, Taylor, Browning, and Loop (3 of the 4 WILL play professionally) and solid contributors like Thompson and Alex over a two-season period.
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I hope you're correct, but I remember the "practice attendees" raving about our improved defense LAST off-season... guys were quicker, faster, and better rebounders. We were going to benefit because James Kelly really wasn't that good on defense in 2015-16, and his replacement was going to be able to run, have long arms, and harass opponents. Truth is, we were below average on defense.
The talk last year was the vaunted press which, we were promised, Danny was going to install and play for 40 minutes/game. Then, after the season started and the press wasn't unveiled, it was said Danny was saving it for conference play. On and on. Truth is, we never really saw much of a press all year.
This year, the off-season talk is how much everyone has improved. But after one of the players who has improved so much decides to head to med school/transfer, we are advised it is not a problem.
Well i respect your opinion. And i love the guys we lost from last year. But if you think Browning and Loop can play defense like Burks watson and West, or even close, then i'm lost for words. And do you realize we made the championship game last year? Some of you act like DD isn't making progress. This year is going to be fun fun fun. Like i said i am more excited about this year than any of DD's previous 3. How many they win? I don't know. But they are going to be exciting and a very easy team to be proud of and cheer for. Now if we don't have a monster year in 2018-2019 then i will be sorely dissappointed. But i couldn't be more excited about the future. And BTW DD told me out of his own mouth we will be pressing more and playing much quicker this year. There was reasons he couldn't do that last year and he told me why. But i will not get into that on a message board.
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I'm looking forward to the season as well but there are some valid questions that hopefully DD can answer.
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With Taylor, Browning, Loop, and now Thompson leaving DD must now replace 50 points per game of offense and 21 rebounds per game. Burks, Penava, Watson & Koljanin stepping into their shoes to pick up the loss of those points & rebounds. Need West, Williams, Bledsoe, Thieneman & Milovic to pick up the points & rebounds from the bench this year. Maybe DD will surprise us and find another player who can help.
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If we don't fill that scholarship look for Danny to pull the red shirt off Darius
that will have to suffice but....
if i'm correct, semester registration is around the 14th and potentially as late as the 25th? is this the latest an addition player (GT or otherwise) can come in and be eligible to play immediately, first game? even if they wouldn't be acclimated to DD ball and teammates, i'd sure feel better with another experienced rebounder/post-mid defender off the bench.
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It's all building and coming to a head in 2018-2019 season. Just enjoy the ride and watch how the young players develop. Never been this excited about Herd basketball EVER!!!! I know some say its always next year. But that is truly when it all comes together. Going to be exciting this year watching this team develop and mesh and then the BUZZ is going to be off the charts for the 2018-2019 season.
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Again, many of us are "tempering" our enthusiasm if, for no other reason, that its still early August, the final season roster has not been set, and, finally, the season schedule has not been released.
Hopefully, the schedule will be out by the end of the month. Then, my attention will turn to the number of OOC road games we will have: Illinois and Xavier for sure, ditto for Morehead, Toledo and Ohio U. Apparently Bill & Mary also. A key to the season's overall success may well just be how well we fare against the road opponents. That is due to the fact that Danny D. has won only about 3 or 4 road non-conference games in 3 seasons.
No one disputes that Herd BB is on a steady uptick under D'Antoni. The key to the next step, meaningful post season participation, will be improving our overall play on the road this season, which will mean that we should be at or near the top of the league when tourney time rolls around. That and an improved RPI along with a deep CUSA tourney run should greatly improve our chances of getting into the NIT/NCAA.
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Honestly for the first time ever, wins and losses is not the most important thing to me. And it's because I can see without a doubt where the program is headed. I've been going to practice for many years and there is such a distinction between what DD is doing compared to previous coaches it's night and day. The team under DD is getting so much bigger. And I have seen how he developed players. Peneva 2 more years, Williams 4 more years, Bennett 4 more years, George 4 more years etc....anyone that goes to practice and is able to see, marshall basketball is headed for some monster years.
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Again, many of us are "tempering" our enthusiasm if, for no other reason, that its still early August, the final season roster has not been set, and, finally, the season schedule has not been released.
Hopefully, the schedule will be out by the end of the month. Then, my attention will turn to the number of OOC road games we will have: Illinois and Xavier for sure, ditto for Morehead, Toledo and Ohio U. Apparently Bill & Mary also. A key to the season's overall success may well just be how well we fare against the road opponents. That is due to the fact that Danny D. has won only about 3 or 4 road non-conference games in 3 seasons.
No one disputes that Herd BB is on a steady uptick under D'Antoni. The key to the next step, meaningful post season participation, will be improving our overall play on the road this season, which will mean that we should be at or near the top of the league when tourney time rolls around. That and an improved RPI along with a deep CUSA tourney run should greatly improve our chances of getting into the NIT/NCAA.
It looks pretty sure that the one final game we are trying to book may well be a D2. Danny hates it. He really wanted to play a money game on the road. He tried Ohio State, Clemson and Indiana that I know of. All had openings and none would play. We know the the exempt tournament in which we play Illinois on the road will get us home games against Southern, UT-Martin and again this year, NCCU. I think this is at least 3 years in a row that we have played the Eagles in this event.
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Nd central is a pretty good team every year. Usually in ncaa tourney. One thing about DD is he won't shy from competition. I like the scheduling. Play local or rival type teams (Ohio toledo Akron morehead emu etc) and then every big name you can get. Next year gonzaga and wash st out west. He loves the challange.
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It looks pretty sure that the one final game we are trying to book may well be a D2. Danny hates it. He really wanted to play a money game on the road. He tried Ohio State, Clemson and Indiana that I know of. All had openings and none would play. We know the the exempt tournament in which we play Illinois on the road will get us home games against Southern, UT-Martin and again this year, NCCU. I think this is at least 3 years in a row that we have played the Eagles in this event.
Which is why, HM, that if we continue to improve, and find success, under Danny that he, Cline and perhaps Mike Hamrick will try to enhance our schedule. This exempt event means one thing, mainly: that Herd fans will be treated to 3 nondescript opponents every year at the Cam. Personally, a slap in the face to loyal fans. Personally, have no real desire to see more than an occasional game against the Florida A&M, Alabama AT&Ts, etc., etc., of the world. If we can't do better than that, then I say dump this event, try to sign a couple more home and home deals with other mid-majors, Miami (O), JMU or ETSU, who are not that far from Huntington. Then try to see if there is any possibility of getting into a Quality in season tourney, like the Alaska Shoot Out, where the Herd played when Jirsa was the HC. At least you have the chance of playing a Power school like California of the PAC 12 whom we played in the Alaska tourney. Would think the Herd would be much better playing in a neutral site tourney where we could get some name opponents on a neutral floor than playing 3 podunks at home and then become the sacrificial lamb for the like of OSU, Louisville, UK, etc., on their home floor. Even the tourney out west a couple seasons ago where we lost to a good Grand Canyon team and beat a quality mid-major, Wyoming, is better than the exempt event, IMO.
Would love to see our reputation grow in basketball where the Herd EVERY SEASON is considered for the pre season NIT, or other QUALITY tourneys held prior to the start of the conference season!!
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Which is why, HM, that if we continue to improve, and find success, under Danny that he, Cline and perhaps Mike Hamrick will try to enhance our schedule. This exempt event means one thing, mainly: that Herd fans will be treated to 3 nondescript opponents every year at the Cam. Personally, a slap in the face to loyal fans. Personally, have no real desire to see more than an occasional game against the Florida A&M, Alabama AT&Ts, etc., etc., of the world. If we can't do better than that, then I say dump this event, try to sign a couple more home and home deals with other mid-majors, Miami (O), JMU or ETSU, who are not that far from Huntington. Then try to see if there is any possibility of getting into a Quality in season tourney, like the Alaska Shoot Out, where the Herd played when Jirsa was the HC. At least you have the chance of playing a Power school like California of the PAC 12 whom we played in the Alaska tourney. Would think the Herd would be much better playing in a neutral site tourney where we could get some name opponents on a neutral floor than playing 3 podunks at home and then become the sacrificial lamb for the like of OSU, Louisville, UK, etc., on their home floor. Even the tourney out west a couple seasons ago where we lost to a good Grand Canyon team and beat a quality mid-major, Wyoming, is better than the exempt event, IMO.
Would love to see our reputation grow in basketball where the Herd EVERY SEASON is considered for the pre season NIT, or other QUALITY tourneys held prior to the start of the conference season!!
If you don't play in an exempt event, you only get 29 games. With it you get 31.
The event a couple years ago was also an exempt event . We played one home game and then the 2 neutral court games.
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NC Central is a decent team and has been for a few years. They beat N Kentucky last year that everyone was raving about with John Brannen going to the NCAA. They beat Missouri and also went to the NCAA tournament again. I would love to have some name teams come to the CAM. And you don't think Danny would love that also? He is willing to play anyone anytime and anywhere and that is a fact. I'm sure he would appreciate it if anyone could get those set up for him, home or on the road. I think our schedule is pretty good actually.
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We need to be better for teams to want to play us. Losing by 40 to a crappy Ohio St. team does not help.
Bennett needs to play this year for 18-19 to be really something to be excited about.
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Honestly for the first time ever, wins and losses is not the most important thing to me. And it's because I can see without a doubt where the program is headed. I've been going to practice for many years and there is such a distinction between what DD is doing compared to previous coaches it's night and day. The team under DD is getting so much bigger. And I have seen how he developed players. Peneva 2 more years, Williams 4 more years, Bennett 4 more years, George 4 more years etc....anyone that goes to practice and is able to see, marshall basketball is headed for some monster years.
I disagree. Dan needs to win games. Elmore might be gone next year and if Bennett isn't eligible this year it will dampen expectations next year.
He needs to win to have a shot at getting some of these impact players being produced by the state over the next 2-3 years.
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If you don't play in an exempt event, you only get 29 games. With it you get 31.
The event a couple years ago was also an exempt event . We played one home game and then the 2 neutral court games.
Obviously then, HM, there must be a hell of a lot of exempt events out there as just about every team you look up has 31 games during the regular season. That means there are a lot of other opportunities to get into some other exempt tourney besides the one we have been in for several years that produces virtually nothing but "dogs" as Herd opponents in the CAM every season.
Fact is that Coaching staff may have to be willing to go on the road or to a neutral site to get in one of these better events with higher caliber opponents. Not sure at this time our staff is willing to do so. Just saying as we continue to improve our team and hopefully find more success in terms of Ws and Ls, I hope the overall quality of our schedule, particularly OOC, continues to climb.
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Well hell....lets just give up even though we are set to have a huge run the next couple seasons. And to say if Bennett doesn't get eligible it will dampen the 2018-2019 season? How many times have we had the size we will have with actual skill. Peneva 6 9" with a 7 foot wing span and another full year under his belt. Williams 6 8" and tons of potential with a year under his belt. Kaljonin 6 8" will be a senior and has a ton of tools. George 6 7" or bigger by then and unbelievable talent. Bennett need i say more. Robinette is going to be a nice player also at 6 8" Then you still have Watson, West, Burks and Theineman that has been shooting the lights out in practice with 3 years under his belt by then. And i do think Elmore will be back his SR year. But if he isn't West will be more than adequate. That is a lot of size skill and quickness. Haven't seen that much of a team package since????? But i'm done posting because obviously the verdict is in. Have a good day and season Herdfans!!!!
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Well hell....lets just give up even though we are set to have a huge run the next couple seasons. And to say if Bennett doesn't get eligible it will dampen the 2018-2019 season? How many times have we had the size we will have with actual skill. Peneva 6 9" with a 7 foot wing span and another full year under his belt. Williams 6 8" and tons of potential with a year under his belt. Kaljonin 6 8" will be a senior and has a ton of tools. George 6 7" or bigger by then and unbelievable talent. Bennett need i say more. Robinette is going to be a nice player also at 6 8" Then you still have Watson, West, Burks and Theineman that has been shooting the lights out in practice with 3 years under his belt by then. And i do think Elmore will be back his SR year. But if he isn't West will be more than adequate. That is a lot of size skill and quickness. Haven't seen that much of a team package since????? But i'm done posting because obviously the verdict is in. Have a good day and season Herdfans!!!!
Let's temper this a little bit and wait to see if what we're "set to have" in the next couple of seasons BECOMES REALITY. We've heard these glowing pie in the sky reports before regarding preseason practice sessions where EVERY Herd player is a sure fire All American. So Theineman has been shooting the lights out in practice. Well, its what he does, or will do, in REAL games that matters. Remember last year, we heard that former state player of the year Kilgore was really shooting the lights out and that Ot Elmore was the best shooter on the team! Well, where are they now? Thompson is now gone. This time next year, there may be another early defection or two. Its the nature of the college game today, like it or not.
No one is "down" on DD and his team. I'll be very happy is the team improves its road record to .500 or better, and wins 23-24 games in the regular season. If we compete again for the CUSA championship and reach meaningful post season play, I'd think that would be achieving significant milestones in year 4. Bring on the Herd!!
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People are just throwing some reality into the basketball hype. We lost 50 points and 21 rebounds per game from those players gone now. We have capable starters joining Jon Elmore in Burks, Watson, Koljanin & Penava to take the place of Browning, Taylor, Loop & Thompson, but it's the development and play of the backups that is going to define how good this team becomes. West, Thienemen, Bledsoe, Williams & Mijovic have not proven they can be significant contributors yet. The top 5 subs last season averaged 24 points and 12 rebounds per game. Both the starters & subs both have a challenge to prove it on the court.
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(Dupl. post)
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couple of points mentioned here: IN OOC, not factoring who we played the last three years we improved the home wins total last year so maybe we're finally trending up AT HOME.
Away OOC games over the three years is inexcusably terrible but we know that during the "new program building" DD said he was more concerned how they played as they approached CUSA tourney time---OK, that's acceptable then, but no matter who is on the roster this year, DD's team, needs to continue the home wins, but more importantly, they have to start winning more of the away OOC, to strengthen chances of post season play, should there be a 2nd look at CUSA from the NCAA. in other words, we must be in the mix should/when the top of CUSA does have a strong year.
if i'm accurate, probably close enough:
in 2014-15 we were 4-9 in OOC, 4-4 at home, 0-5 away/nuetral
in 2015-16 we were 4-9 in OOC, 3-2 at home, 1-7 away/neutral
in 2016-17 we were 7-6 in OOC, 7-0 at home, 0-6 away/neutral
bottom line is that DD's team has to get to a full scholarship roster (full bench), has to come together quicker/earlier in the year and has to win a higher percentage of away games while consistently defending the M....a lot to ask for but this is what separates.
i'm excited and i look forward to this year knowing that we're close to achieving this but that this year is extremely critical to taking that step.
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I know many are against it but I would like to see us play in the CIT or CBI if for only to get some post season experience and get into that mindset. IF 2018-19 is truly our year, a trip to the NCAA or NIT seems pretty certain, if that happens, the experience of having been in the post season would certainly seem to help the first tournament game jitters, so we don't spend the first half of that game "getting used to the tourney environment". JMO
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People are just throwing some reality into the basketball hype. We lost 50 points and 21 rebounds per game from those players gone now. We have capable starters joining Jon Elmore in Burks, Watson, Koljanin & Penava to take the place of Browning, Taylor, Loop & Thompson, but it's the development and play of the backups that is going to define how good this team becomes. West, Thienemen, Bledsoe, Williams & Mijovic have not proven they can be significant contributors yet. The top 5 subs last season averaged 24 points and 12 rebounds per game. Both the starters & subs both have a challenge to prove it on the court.
Sorry for the "hype". I won't post anymore about what i see at basketball practices again.
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We understand. If someone glows about FB its just koolade but if BB its stark reality.
Some like me have been watching, eating, breathing and sleeping Herd BB since the 1950s but we also like FB. Dig?
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Sorry for the "hype". I won't post anymore about what i see at basketball practices again.
I think you took that the wrong way. No offense intended, and your BB reports are really appreciated.
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We understand. If someone glows about FB its just koolade but if BB its stark reality.
Some like me have been watching, eating, breathing and sleeping Herd BB since the 1950s but we also like FB. Dig?
I can truly relate! Speaking of Herd Hoops in the 50'-60's. My lifelong friend and the reason I am a Herd fan, Lou Mott, who was here 56-60 just celebrated his 80th birthday on Sunday.
He drives down here from New Martinsville a couple times a year and stays with me to attend a couple hoops and football games every year. The stories he can tell about MAC players, and Oscar Robertson are great.
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Walked two blocks from Enslow to MFH when I was eleven or twelve and was hooked. Either 1958 or maybe 59 I saw Sydenstricker and Larry Carter maybe..and the 6'11 center from BUGS that had a great pro career. I didn't follow FB much until Sonny Randle. Its all good.
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the 6'11 center from BUGS that had a great pro career
Nate Thurmond
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Exactly
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https://www.bloggersodear.com/2017/7/30/16065474/wake-forest-basketball-potential-graduate-transfer-former-marshall-terrence-thompson-dinos-mitoglou
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No he didn't screw us
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At one time Nate Thurmond was the third best center in league behind Wilt and Bill Russell.
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Bob Allen from Marshall was Nate Thurmond's backup in the pros for a while.
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https://cbbcentral.wordpress.com/2017/08/08/top-unsigned-grad-transfers-that-will-impact-the-2017-18-season/
Possible Grad Transfers still on the board.
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https://cbbcentral.wordpress.com/2017/08/08/top-unsigned-grad-transfers-that-will-impact-the-2017-18-season/
Possible Grad Transfers still on the board.
I see Jack Whitman is still on the list. I believe Herdmeister and others have mentioned him before.
The article says it wouldn't be a surprise to see him at the mid-major level.
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Clock is ticking !!! Is the last day to get a Transfer the first day of classes? If so when is that?
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I understand that Whitman is no longer on the list. :(
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Where is he? Seems like a good fit for him a MU.
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I understand that Whitman is no longer on the list. :(
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For those that go to practice has Milan Mijovic improved enough to help us out underneath?
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Not in my opinion. Out of position and stands and watches others.........however he is better than when he got here. Just my 2 cents..........
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IMO , he tries hard , really hard , its just not there . He can give someone a few minutes of rest . Hes a great guy , just not a great ball player .
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Its going to take more than a "space occupier" in games where Penava gets into early foul trouble, or gets hampered with injuries, etc. Need some inside presence with some skills if for no other reasons than depth. Inexperienced newcomers or redshirts just may not be enough.
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I understand that Whitman is no longer on the list. :(
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He seems to have no interest in coming here.
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Looks like DD is not going to be able to bring in a big body GT player. With 6-9 Mijovic being limited as to ability, it might be best to see if we can land a good Wing GT. If that is the case, then maybe 6-9 Williams backs up Penava, and 6-6 Bledsoe backs up Koljanin. This would still allow DD to RS George. I've lost track if the final decision on Bennett has been announced or not.
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Whitman may think more of his worth than he should. ;)
I dont think the final decision has been made with Iran. Im betting he wont be able to play this year.
George may end up on the court this season.