Topic: I hope some of the simple minds have it figured now

[catbird70]

I was at the game I think Jimmy played well enough for us to win.  We just couldn't run the ball and I don't know if Morris would have played if it would have made a difference or not. You can't get a punt blocked and fumble twice in the first half(in your own territory) and win.  We also got whipped on the line of scrimmage.

Jimmy played pretty well I thought.  Take away the turnovers(the early ones) and we are right there in it.

Good post Herdman...

Jimmy Skinner 285 yards and 1 TD

Pinkney 270 yards and 1 TD

Considering our starter has played approx. 6 quarters of football before today...not so bad....

If you look back at what weve done all season long....I bet that 285 yards passing is not a bad game....i know its not our biggest game passing wise...but not our worst either.....but RB wise it was well below average...and its really not Bradshaws fault...he really just had one turnover and then they decided not go with a balanced offense any more.....dont know why....but we arent the coaches...

[2xBison]

i agree with herdman, js played well enough to win.  it would have been nice if he hit spann on the first drive.  that was a TD.  get that, and take the refs out maybe we do get it done.

lastly, for those somehow wondering about bradshaw........ECU..much like memphis and tulane.......and likely everyone else we play will take away the run and dare us to throw.  against tulane, we had enough success to finally soften them up and get AB going, never did today.

[catbird70]

i agree with herdman, js played well enough to win.  it would have been nice if he hit spann on the first drive.  that was a TD.  get that, and take the refs out maybe we do get it done.

lastly, for those somehow wondering about bradshaw........ECU..much like memphis and tulane.......and likely everyone else we play will take away the run and dare us to throw.  against tulane, we had enough success to finally soften them up and get AB going, never did today.

I agree...except that....I dont think we tried to run the ball with Bradshaw enough to know if ECU would have been able to take away our run....

just my opinion....

[Dreamherd]

Kueck doesn't know how to keep Bradshaw going when the game gets tough.  He abandons the run to quickly.  He calls to many passing plays when Skinner is the QB.  He always has and always will as long as he is calling the plays around here.  I hope Snyder shakes up his staff b/c we are going nowhere with the coords. we have right now.

[catbird70]

since we're playing for 07 now.

Not quite..  we can win our final two and be bowl eligible.  It will be tough, but not impossible.

Skinner may be in the game next week too......we can get the win if we can have a balanced offense even with a crappy defense...but as Snyder says.....we havent even turned the corner if the offense is bailing out the defense......Bradshaw needs the ball 40-60% of the time.....

This from the other board:

Bernie can barely walk, he shouldn't have made the trip. He was on crutches until Wednesday of this week. That's why he didn't go in for Skinner LA HERDFAN.

[/i][/b]

[DJdaHERDfan]

Without Bernie in the mix as QB, the Herd is in a tight spot offensively.

I think what 2xbison is trying to say is this:

With Bernie Morris as QB, the defense has to play safe in watching for him to run. Bernie's legs keep Herd drives alive. When their is nothing there and the screen isn't available, BM can take off, not only scramble, but actually make people miss and turn a no gain - 3 yard Skinner sramble into a BM 15 - 19 YARD GAIN. And let's not forget about the option.

Also, just when the opposing defense starts focusing in on BM, here comes the Bradshaw misdirection play. Or here comes Chubb Small running for a big gain.

With Skinner in there, that option was taking away. The defense then keyed in on Bradshaw and the running game, forcing Skinner to beat them.
Now a couple of things happened all together to limit AB to 10 touches.
#1 Bradshaw lets the defensive stops get to him and lets his emotions take him out of his game.
#2 Bradshaw fumbled the ball away.
#3 Offensive game plan abandoned the run too quick.

When Skinner came in for BM in relief, he was a fresh breath of air because he could move the ball on defenses that prepared for BM and AB style of play.

Now with Skinner the starter, defenses can prepare the way ECU did. Take away running game and make QB beat you with his arm.

If BM isn't back for UTEP, we are in serious trouble.

This is BERNIE MORRIS's team and they really missed their leader Saturday.

TURNOVERS is the bottom line. We made too many mistakes and it cost us the game.

[GreenVooDoo]

I have.....10 touches for Bradshaw isnt enough to win any game this season....Bradshaw is awesome.....but how do we know they can stop him if he only gets 10 touches?

Hey Cat, were you at the game? I was and ECU shut him down completely. Would you want us to give it to him 25+ times for 50 yards and about 10 3 and outs? Our defense would have given up 50+ in that case.

ECU defense has stopped every running back this year, including Steve Slaton and WVU's 300+ a game rushing stats.

I'm sure you're a passionate fan, but what the TV doesn't show you, being in the stands does. There WERE NO running lanes, period. When that's stopped and were down 13, do we run run run and give them the ball back? Me thinks not. Let the coaches coach and us watch.

[herdman]

But, the same exact thing has happened with Bernie as QB. Teams are going to try to stop the run and force Bernie to beat them with his arm. He has yet be able to do that.  He makes critical mistakes in the passing game.  Teams stack the line when he plays and they literally say we will make this guy beat us with his arm.  Look at BM's touchdown to interception ratio and see if that is a safe bet on the other teams part.

[2xBison]

don't disagree herdman.  teams can do it to bernie too.  i think memphis pretty much dared us to throw.  that's why bm was 2/3 with nice yardage and JS put up some great numbers.  but, the option amd a running qb at least give them something to wonder about or contain.  they didn't worry about js pulling it out of abs gut and heading for the corner.

next year, our o line and wr core has got to get better, of course along with qb play.  as i've said all year, i think TE and RB are really the only areas we are up to our old standards on offense.

[GreenSteve]

[GreenSteve]

[catbird70]

don't disagree herdman.  teams can do it to bernie too.  i think memphis pretty much dared us to throw.  that's why bm was 2/3 with nice yardage and JS put up some great numbers.  but, the option amd a running qb at least give them something to wonder about or contain.  they didn't worry about js pulling it out of abs gut and heading for the corner.

next year, our o line and wr core has got to get better, of course along with qb play.  as i've said all year, i think TE and RB are really the only areas we are up to our old standards on offense.

Im not going to speculate for sure...but people (not me anymore) might have gone after Morris even more after this game than they are going after skinner right now.....if Morris had played instead of Skinner

If you fall in line with what people have been saying (that Morris is better on the gournd and Skinner in the air) then you might assume that since ECU was putting so many in the box and focusing on just stopping the run...maybe it was best that Skinner played this one out since he is the better passer...who knows it could have been much worse without Skinner for that particular game.

Maybe Snyder had no choice but to just start throwing the ball...who knows....


But I tend to be sold more on the fact that they didnt stop the run completely...they stopped it some and we helped them by abandoning it.....I hate to over cheer for Bradshaw....dont want to get annoying about it but Bradshaw needs more than 10 touches....i think he was almost 7 yards a carry on Saturday....with only 1 legit fumble.

[catbird70]

I have.....10 touches for Bradshaw isnt enough to win any game this season....Bradshaw is awesome.....but how do we know they can stop him if he only gets 10 touches?

Hey Cat, were you at the game? I was and ECU shut him down completely. Would you want us to give it to him 25+ times for 50 yards and about 10 3 and outs? Our defense would have given up 50+ in that case.

ECU defense has stopped every running back this year, including Steve Slaton and WVU's 300+ a game rushing stats.

I'm sure you're a passionate fan, but what the TV doesn't show you, being in the stands does. There WERE NO running lanes, period. When that's stopped and were down 13, do we run run run and give them the ball back? Me thinks not. Let the coaches coach and us watch.

Im definitely for letting the coaches coach....I honestly dont know for sure.....thats my caveat throughout....Im just speculating....and hoping that no harm is done by that.....  We need to support the coach and trust that we couldnt do a better job or even know where to begin to run a program.

Dont forget that Bradshaw got averaged just under 7 yards per carry on Saturday.....I didnt see the game...so I have to rely on stats....maybe there is some way that 7 yards per carry is scewed by a couple of really big runs and that an average of 8 of the carrries was like 0 or 1 yard per carry.....I dont know.....since you were there maybe you can explain to me how he got shut down with almost 7 yards per carry.....thanks for your concern and help.

[DJdaHERDfan]

CATBIRD:

BRADSHAW HAD 9 CARRIES FOR 24 YARDS FOR NEARLY THE ENTIRE GAME

You are really driving a ridiculous statement into the ground to an even more ridiculous level.

Facts are that Bradshaw and the Herd running game wasn't working. Herd fell behind by too many points. When AB got the ball, he fumbled twice out of the 9 carries.

The running game was not gonna get it done.

Should there have been more tries? more carries? YES YES

But the HEAD COACH AND COACHING STAFF decided not to and I trust their judgement over any opinion on this board.

I STILL BELIEVE this thing is getting turned around. Snyder has got some very positive things to build on for 2007 and beyond.

I look for this team to finish on a positive note with good expectations for next year.

If Herd wins 5 games, things look good for 2007.

If HERD wins 6 games, they might get a bowl bid and that means EXTRA PRACTICE TIME that would be very valuable and things would be looking better for 2007.

[catbird70]

CATBIRD:

BRADSHAW HAD 9 CARRIES FOR 24 YARDS FOR NEARLY THE ENTIRE GAME

You are really driving a ridiculous statement into the ground to an even more ridiculous level.

Facts are that Bradshaw and the Herd running game wasn't working. Herd fell behind by too many points. When AB got the ball, he fumbled twice out of the 9 carries.

The running game was not gonna get it done.

Should there have been more tries? more carries? YES YES

But the HEAD COACH AND COACHING STAFF decided not to and I trust their judgement over any opinion on this board.

I STILL BELIEVE this thing is getting turned around. Snyder has got some very positive things to build on for 2007 and beyond.

I look for this team to finish on a positive note with good expectations for next year.

If Herd wins 5 games, things look good for 2007.

If HERD wins 6 games, they might get a bowl bid and that means EXTRA PRACTICE TIME that would be very valuable and things would be looking better for 2007.

Wow...I wasnt making statements as much as I was asking a question...but not to you.....

Since you seem to know all the facts.....then tell me this...AND IM JUST ASKING....sincerely.....

he had 10 carries and 9 of them were for a total of 24 yards?  If that is true then thats pretty convincing that they shut him down....

[catbird70]

Thats the biggest thing....I think extra practice time would be huge....especially for more back up QBs maybe....next year we have some pretty green QBs coming in....they need some practice time to learn the system...the more the better...

[GreenVooDoo]

Dude, again right from Herdzone.com..

Rushing              No Gain Loss  Net TD Lg  Avg
-------------------------------------------------
Bradshaw, Ahmad      10   27    1   26  2  5  2.6

Here's the link.......

http://herdzone.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2006-2007/mu10.html#GAME.IND

Click "Individual Statistics" and you'll see the "Final Game Stats." In fact here is ESPN's game stats as well........

                         CAR YDS AVG TD LG
Ahmad Bradshaw 10    26   2.6   2   5

Link.....http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/boxscore?gameId=263150151

His long run of the day was 5 yards. There were no 8-15 yard runs. I was there and I saw the defense. Our QB and WR's did the best they could, but unfortunetly didn't "git-r-done."

[catbird70]

FINE......Thats just not easy to swallow....Ive just never seen Marshall get stuffed like that.....Im not sure Ive seen any team get stuffed liked that....very weird...

[ATHENSHERDFAN]

Our running problems early dictated the need to throw.... The O-line did a very good job blocking for pass protection.... JS seemed at times to have an eternity to throw....  Our O's inability to complete passes was more of a problem than the lack of a running game....  Which brings another point, AB was seeing pine for a while because of the fumbles, which also contributed to his lack of touches....  Unless BM would have been more accurate with his throws, the outcome would have been the same...  JS was fortunate to not have thrown more INT's than he did...The Officials were terrible...Why does the D continue to play a third down scheme that has failed for 6 straight weeks....