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The Green and White Sector
The place to talk Marshall University sports! => HerdFans => Topic started by: HerdFanJ on January 14, 2018, 12:32:36 PM
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https://twitter.com/boogXIV/status/952590243248603136
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Lol. Hope he learns to throw a pass more than 5 yards. Good luck Chase. Another Darius Marshall.
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I wish him the best and thank him for his time here. I really hope he makes it. But I am glad we will be going in another direction. I am now pumped that we will see a fresh start with the offense next season. Get that OC in here and lets get a CUSA Championship.
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Xavier!
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or Kai Locksley?
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lol this has to be a joke ;D
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All the proof you need that Chase is all about Chase. I can't run the ball, I might get hurt. I can't make it to the Louisville game, Im afraid. I can't show up for the Western, KY game, I might be embarrassed. He puts himself ahead of his teammates. All we can hope is that this decision was encouraged by the coaches because they intend to go in a different direction next year. That said, I hope he makes it and I hope he makes it big.
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I thought the same ThunderValley, still kind of in shock that he’s going to try the NFL
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Good new OC new QB.... Time for change I'm sure he probably knew he might not even start for us.
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Can you declare and not hire an agent and go back to college or is this final? I wont judge anyone because look at what Clark did by making the Packers...Chase is physically the right size and maybe with different coaching he might make it.
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Little early for an April Fools joke isn't it? LOL
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Can you declare and not hire an agent and go back to college or is this final? I wont judge anyone because look at what Clark did by making the Packers...Chase is physically the right size and maybe with different coaching he might make it.
In basketball, you can. In football, once you declare your college career is over.
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We once had a back-up QB go get some strong consideration in Seattle as a FA... what was his name?
Part of me can understand why he made this choice, but I'm one of those who think he at least should have waited to learn who the new OC would be.
Or, then again, maybe he knows something the rest of us don't, and that prompted the announcement (?).
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Notice he didn’t say anything about the fans!
Wish him luck.
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We once had a back-up QB go get some strong consideration in Seattle as a FA... what was his name?
Part of me can understand why he made this choice, but I'm one of those who think he at least should have waited to learn who the new OC would be.
Or, then again, maybe he knows something the rest of us don't, and that prompted the announcement (?).
Derrick Devine I believe was his name.
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I have mixed emotions about Chase leaving. A big part of me is wishing he would stay to finish what could be a special season. On the other hand, Chase is abandoning his teammates and Herd fans. I wish Chase the best, but if he doesn't want to be here next Herd QB up.
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Notice he didn’t say anything about the fans!
Wish him luck.
If I were in his shoes, I might be very selective in which fans I chose to thank, and would do so privately. Without any interest in pointing fingers, I can't really ever recall that degree of animosity between a college team's fans and the team's QB. Was all the more surprising after such a positive freshman year for him and his family here.
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Big on potential talent, short on character, selflessness and leadership. A recipe for a very short run at the next level. I certainly don’t wish for failure for Chase but I never really felt a strong connection as a fan for him like I did Payton, Hill, Pennington, and Leftwich.
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I hate wvu, but Grier is light years better than Litton, and he decided to stay because it was such a QB-heavy draft. Makes no sense. Horrible advice he got.
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Xavier!
He is a TE now.
Isiah Green was the back up last year. True freshman.
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Xavier!
Wasn't Xavier recruited as an "athlete"? I seem to remember he didn't make a big impression when he took some practice time at QB?
We might have a problem with inexperience at the QB position.
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Good luck, Chase. If you think you're ready, go for it. We'll be just fine here and look for your support in the years to come.
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If I were in his shoes, I might be very selective in which fans I chose to thank, and would do so privately. Without any interest in pointing fingers, I can't really ever recall that degree of animosity between a college team's fans and the team's QB. Was all the more surprising after such a positive freshman year for him and his family here.
I am not blaming the fans at all. This fanbase will bend over backwards for the players and stick with them thru almost anything. But on the other hand they expect great character and all out support of the University. Chase did do much better last year, but a lot of the fans had seen enough to sour them from the first 2 years. Like I said....I hope whatever he does he is successful in sports and especially in life. But i'm glad and look forward to next season more than ever now. I just don't think he was the answer to where we would like to go. He was just way to inconsistent with his mechanics and leadership IMO. He had started for 3 years and I don't think that was going to change in his 4th. Whoever takes over will have a learning curve but I think it will give us a much more diverse offense and will bring excitement. I hope it's Green.
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Good luck Chase. Hope you do well.
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https://twitter.com/OptimumScouting/status/952594402135945216
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I saw good luck and I hope everything works out for him. If he were to become the next Tom Brady, I would be very happy. I think he gave us his all this year both on and off the field, that makes up for his mistakes. We all make them, so should always try to forgive and forget.
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https://twitter.com/OptimumScouting/status/952594402135945216
Haha a first rounder... Got anymore jokes, this comedian is great.
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Haha a first rounder... Got anymore jokes, this comedian is great.
Had Chase ever lived up to his potential he could have been. Had he not made this dumb move here, came back thrown for 3,800 yards, 35 TDs and less than 15 INTs while winning a CUSA championship he would have been at least a 3rd round pick. Now he'll go undrafted. What concerns me is how this could impact Tyre Brady's decision.
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Had Chase ever lived up to his potential he could have been. Had he not made this dumb move here, came back thrown for 3,800 yards, 35 TDs and less than 15 INTs while winning a CUSA championship he would have been at least a 3rd round pick. Now he'll go undrafted. What concerns me is how this could impact Tyre Brady's decision.
Good point.
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Wish him the best.....hopefully, he was given good advise.......Puzzling to me.
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He’s got a high (for him) draft grade guys. I tried telling y’all a couple weeks ago. This was expected if a few QBs came back to school and things broke a certai way. I can see him going 3-5 and best of luck to him. We need more Marshall in the NFL.
For clarity sake of my opinion this will be the first time he gets a lights out QB coach. Going middle rounds he will be able to sit and learn. It will be up to him to make the most of it. That will be the key.
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One of the dumbest decisions ever. I defended this kid through thick and thin, but thats over now. He could have had a special year and actually had a chance at the NFL. He blew his future. Its a real shame. But that being said, i am extremely worried about next season now.
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I’ve been critical of Littons decision making in the past but I wish him well. He was at a disadvantage with a new OC coming in for next year. His body and arm strength will give him an opportunity to play at the next level and I hope he finds success.
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He’s got a high (for him) draft grade guys. I tried telling y’all a couple weeks ago. This was expected if a few QBs came back to school and things broke a certai way. I can see him going 3-5 and best of luck to him. We need more Marshall in the NFL.
For clarity sake of my opinion this will be the first time he gets a lights out QB coach. Going middle rounds he will be able to sit and learn. It will be up to him to make the most of it. That will be the key.
I'm no QB analyst but I just don't see it. There are a lot of QBs in this draft. My guess would be FA and stick around on a team for development. I understand he is physically the type of guy the NFL wants but there's plenty of NFL body QBs probably ahead of him.
I have no insight but I suspect he has been told who the OC will be and it's someone that likes to run the QB. Leave now or possibly get benched and lose any stock you've created for NFL.
I should also add that I do hope he does well and would love him to be the next Tom Brady.
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https://twitter.com/ckparrot/status/952596866872545280
https://twitter.com/nfldraftscout/status/952601203191566336
https://twitter.com/CDonScouting/status/948781695481864198
https://twitter.com/DonJamesSports/status/948442616361816064
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https://twitter.com/isaiah_green17/status/952596561606922240?s=17
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I wish Chase all the best. It takes a ton of work to be a college athlete. That being said, he has showed flashes of brilliance mixed with moments of sub-par play. If he is drafted, I hope someone is able to really develop him. He has a cannon for an arm, and if he can get consistent accuracy with it, he will be fun to watch. Thanks a bunch Chase for your hard work. Go Herd!
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Maybe he knows who the new OC is going to be , didn't think his play would jive with his . Really , what more can he prove here ? Next season would have probably been like this one . The NFL people can develop him better than anyone MU can hire . If they think he has a shot , they'll spend the time needed . I hope it works out , If he makes it , great for him .
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If I were in his shoes, I might be very selective in which fans I chose to thank, and would do so privately. Without any interest in pointing fingers, I can't really ever recall that degree of animosity between a college team's fans and the team's QB. Was all the more surprising after such a positive freshman year for him and his family here.
He didn't catch hell his Freshman year. It wasn't until he put on the #1 and thought the world was going to fall into his lap that fans turned on him. He forgot you have to earn it, still. And breaking team rules etc, etc. Last year was mostly fans upset with his mechanics but not his character. In fact, I'd say more people were mad at the coaches for not preparing him better as a third year starter than at Chase for trying.
I'll never forgive him, in 2016, sitting out Louisville and throwing Morrell to the wolves, while completely medically cleared to play and then creating the situation that kept him out of WKU game, where we received the worst beating in our stadium, in history. You want to kiss his ass for those things? Pucker up, Sturt. I don't need him to thank me or care if he does. But it goes both ways. He's an inconsistent average QB, at best, in Marshall's history. And any game you can point to he won for us, I can point to two he lost for us pretty much single-handedly, meaning everyone else appeared to be doing their jobs.
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He didn't catch hell his Freshman year. It wasn't until he put on the #1 and thought the world was going to fall into his lap that fans turned on him. He forgot you have to earn it, still. And breaking team rules etc, etc. Last year was mostly fans upset with his mechanics but not his character. In fact, I'd say more people were mad at the coaches for not preparing him better as a third year starter than at Chase for trying.
I'll never forgive him, in 2016, sitting out Louisville and throwing Morrell to the wolves, while completely medically cleared to play and then creating the situation that kept him out of WKU game, where we received the worst beating in our stadium, in history. You want to kiss his ass for those things? Pucker up, Sturt. I don't need him to thank me or care if he does. But it goes both ways. He's an inconsistent average QB, at best, in Marshall's history. And any game you can point to he won for us, I can point to two he lost for us pretty much single-handedly, meaning everyone else appeared to be doing their jobs.
Um... excuse me? Where the hell did that come from?
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Um... excuse me? Where the hell did that come from?
From the "selective in which fans to thank" post. Forgot to quote it I guess.
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From the "selective in which fans to thank" post. Forgot to quote it I guess.
Sorry, still don't follow you. How that offended you is a mystery to me.
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I'm no QB analyst but I just don't see it. There are a lot of QBs in this draft. My guess would be FA and stick around on a team for development. I understand he is physically the type of guy the NFL wants but there's plenty of NFL body QBs probably ahead of him.
I have no insight but I suspect he has been told who the OC will be and it's someone that likes to run the QB. Leave now or possibly get benched and lose any stock you've created for NFL.
I should also add that I do hope he does well and would love him to be the next Tom Brady.
He has iffy mechanics but most NFL QB coaches thrive on fixing that. That’s a challenge they want from a mid round QB. He should do well in a pro style system, but we all know sometimes he has issues with starring WRs down. Also to a fault of the OC previously we don’t have routes you throw the WR open. He will have to learn that. He won’t be expected to play right away. He’s got a long road to go but measurables are in his favor to at least get a start. He’s literally the exact opposite of Catos draft run.
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Sorry, still don't follow you. How that offended you is a mystery to me.
where do you get he was offended? i think he simply responded making his point. obviously, i dont speak for MUther or any other poster, but why do you think he is offended?
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So Pennington was here 5 years, Leftwich 4 years, Cato 4 years but Chase is ready after 3? What intrigues the scouts the most: his side arm delivery, his 14 pics this year against CUSA talent, his leadership abilities displayed during his sophomore season, or his immense ego? Just when I thought Litton was done with the pipe, he does this. One more season would have helped him IMO. Oh well, let’s hope Isaiah Greene is everything that CL wasn’t.
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He didn't catch hell his Freshman year. It wasn't until he put on the #1 and thought the world was going to fall into his lap that fans turned on him. He forgot you have to earn it, still. And breaking team rules etc, etc. Last year was mostly fans upset with his mechanics but not his character. In fact, I'd say more people were mad at the coaches for not preparing him better as a third year starter than at Chase for trying.
I'll never forgive him, in 2016, sitting out Louisville and throwing Morrell to the wolves, while completely medically cleared to play and then creating the situation that kept him out of WKU game, where we received the worst beating in our stadium, in history. You want to kiss his ass for those things? Pucker up, Sturt. I don't need him to thank me or care if he does. But it goes both ways. He's an inconsistent average QB, at best, in Marshall's history. And any game you can point to he won for us, I can point to two he lost for us pretty much single-handedly, meaning everyone else appeared to be doing their jobs.
This is exactly how I feel about him. Peace out Chase.
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We once had a back-up QB go get some strong consideration in Seattle as a FA... what was his name?
(?).
That's sort of an urban legend among herd fans. Derek Devine was a good kid and went to a few camps as a thrower, but I don't think ever had any serious consideration as a QB at a professional level, even CFL. His family was connected and he was happy enough to spend the summer on the roster. Got in a couple of preseason games with the Redskins. Some posters would try to use it as an argument of the quality of our bench players, the incorrectness of starting some other quarterback or some such nonsense. There's no denying he was on some NFL trading rosters, he never had a real opportunity to make any roster.
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where do you get he was offended? i think he simply responded making his point. obviously, i dont speak for MUther or any other poster, but why do you think he is offended?
Yeah, you're right. I'm too sensitive. Shouldn't take "YOU want to kiss his ass for those things? Pucker up, STURT." as-if there's any antagonism intended.
Hell, Wolf, how do you miss the obvious question... how did my casual observations get interpreted as-if "I want to kiss his ass"... ? ? ?
Stupid silliness.
If you'd like to pursue it further, I'm open to discussing this via PM per the so-called rules.
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That's sort of an urban legend among herd fans. Derek Devine was a good kid and went to a few camps as a thrower, but I don't think ever had any serious consideration as a QB at a professional level, even CFL. His family was connected and he was happy enough to spend the summer on the roster. Got in a couple of preseason games with the Redskins. Some posters would try to use it as an argument of the quality of our bench players, the incorrectness of starting some other quarterback or some such nonsense. There's no denying he was on some NFL trading rosters, he never had a real opportunity to make any roster.
Put it this way... didn't he play in preseason for them? That's a whole lot more than I think any of us ever would have anticipated, no?
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Put it this way... didn't he play in preseason for them? That's a whole lot more than I think any of us ever would have anticipated, no?
He got a couple of late game series as a reward for being a good soldier. Not sure he threw a pass. He was not a Bernie Morris level talent.
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He got a couple of late game series as a reward for being a good soldier. Not sure he threw a pass. He was not a Bernie Morris level talent.
And I still say even to that, "That's a whole lot more than I think any of us ever would have anticipated, no?"
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Yeah, you're right. I'm too sensitive. Shouldn't take "YOU want to kiss his ass for those things? Pucker up, STURT." as-if there's any antagonism intended.
Hell, Wolf, how do you miss the obvious question... how did my casual observations get interpreted as-if "I want to kiss his ass"... ? ? ?
Stupid silliness.
If you'd like to pursue it further, I'm open to discussing this via PM per the so-called rules.
yeah, i think you're too sensitive. i dont think the man is offended I just think he was pointed in his reply/comment to you. but like i said i dont speak for him, so maybe he was offended. if he is then silly me.
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We need to go the JC route next year.I see no way he is ready for the NFL. no OC ,now the news is looking worse.We need a miracle now that what looked to be a great season next year and this is going to hurt.Very depressing.
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And I still say even to that, "That's a whole lot more than I think any of us ever would have anticipated, no?"
The highest level he played other than preseason was two years with the Virginia Destroyers (UFL) for which he accumulated no stats...yeah, let's reserve his spot in Canton.
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I would say it's a surprise to all. Thank him for all he's done and wish him the luck in the world as he moves on.
Time for the next man to step....hope we have that man on campus. Could still be a banner season next year if we can find a good qb.
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We need to go the JC route next year.I see no way he is ready for the NFL. no OC ,now the news is looking worse.We need a miracle now that what looked to be a great season next year and this is going to hurt.Very depressing.
I'm not sure Ed, Green was definitely our QB of the future, my primary concern is we are apparently down to two quarterbacks. But I agree there is concern we go to Oxford with new coordinators, secondary coach and now new QB.
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We need to go the JC route next year.I see no way he is ready for the NFL. no OC ,now the news is looking worse.We need a miracle now that what looked to be a great season next year and this is going to hurt.Very depressing.
Starting QB will be Isaiah Green. Depending on the offensive plan it might have been even if Litton was here, so no worries there. Maybe bring a juco as the backup, but not starter.
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With a new OC and a run spread qb, we may have some very exciting games next year.
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yeah, i think you're too sensitive. i dont think the man is offended I just think he was pointed in his reply/comment to you. but like i said i dont speak for him, so maybe he was offended. if he is then silly me.
You realize, other people have done what you're doing here, and I end up getting some nonsensical heat as-if ***I*** was the one who refused to let go and "hijacked" the thread.
Right?
So, I was serious, I feel you had it right when you made up that particular so-called rule.
I'll only say this much more, and only because you are the admin and because I still hold a lot of respect of you because unlike a lot of people, you've shown yourself someone who isn't too proud to re-think his actions.
At the very least, we should be able to agree that the statement targeted me... he did specify me, right?... and his words were on the antagonistic/abrasive side.
Can I go so far as to assume he was "offended?"
I think so, but maybe there's a better word than "offended."
To me, he seemed pissed off that I said something that, I suppose, he took as some indictment on the fans, of which he is one, and I now realize evidently he was one of the more vocal ones... and he felt I should get some backtalk for it.
I think that's a fair account of the situation.
Again, if you or anyone else including him wants to pursue it, though, I'm only discussing via PM from here on.
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Bam... nailed it. Mentioned this before the season he could leave after jr. year. People didn't like it. Didn't have the year he needed to have but he would not be given slack this year in starting role so its a risk all around. That's why RS etc is a thing of the past. Play them and go unless they won't play at all and that will probably be a wasted scholarship. I do not believe he is ready but the Lamar Jackson is who I'd draft anyways. After that the rest are all the same. All have flaws. He could climb the qb draft board.
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You realize, other people have done what you're doing here, and I end up getting some nonsensical heat as-if ***I*** was the one who refused to let go and "hijacked" the thread.
Again, if you or anyone else including him wants to pursue it, though, I'm only discussing via PM from here on.
Because you keep doing the same things. You're doing it now and trying yet again to act like you're the victim. It's old. It's played. Don't keep saying "you're only discussing it via PM" , then just do it. Quit going back and forth over nothing, hijacking threads and then acting like you've done nothing wrong.
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Starting QB will be Isaiah Green. Depending on the offensive plan it might have been even if Litton was here, so no worries there. Maybe bring a juco as the backup, but not starter.
Bring in a freshman qb that's actually good. Baisden from Martinsburg. Whoever loses battle between Greene and Morrell might dip. Baisden would be there RS and licking his chops. Winner!!!! Hard worker!!! Good blood lines for grit!!!!
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Well people were screaming for change , that's definitely what we will be getting . New OC , new QB , more than likely an all new offense . Im looking forward to next season , gonna be an exciting one that's for sure.
Who is Baisden from Martinsburg ?
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One thing is certain. We will soon find out if the issue was Litton or the coaching he received while with us.
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I’m curious if they bring in another QB this late in the recruiting game? This class already looks to be one of the worst in a decade. I hope some talent emerges.
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Good luck to Chase! He has all the tools. Toughness is the only issue that can't be learned. Wish him all the best.
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Come on back, fans; no excuse now.
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Come on back, fans; no excuse now.
It will be interesting to see who the new OC is and what kind of scheme he has. That will go a long way in getting the fans back. We need to get back to Marshall football, basketball on grass with excitement. Every running play a draw and 80% oif the passes going to the sideline was getting real old. Hopefully the new guy will use a TE more and slants and seam routes a little more. Also would be nice to see a QB under center a few times with real motion. Just my thoughts.
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I think Greene can do the job
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I think Greene can do the job
Green was getting reps with the 1s last spring and from reports he sounded impressive, just not fully ready yet. If you've seen his highlights, he looks good. I hope he does well. I also think Morrell can't be written off, unless he transfers.
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Good luck to Litton.
How about this for a plan? Marshall brings in Iowa Western CC Head Coach Scott Strohmeier as the new Offensive Coordinator. Strohmeier, a former QB, is this year's juco coach of the year, the second time he has won the award. He has an impressive resume.
http://www.goreivers.com/general/2017-18/releases/20171219gwyv8l
Strohmeier brings with him his QB, Kai Locksley, the juco Offensive Player of the Year.
http://www.goreivers.com/sports/fball/2017-18/releases/20171220k48cte
Strohmeier also brings with him a couple of other juco All-Americans from Iowa Western CC.
http://www.goreivers.com/general/2017-18/releases/20171219hp286j
Iowa Western CC is where the Herd got RB Anthony Anderson, and where Locksley migrated shortly after verbally committing to the Herd. Clearly, the coaching staff is familiar with this juco program. Also, it is interesting that Locksley is still unsigned as far as I can tell based on the article below. Now that the deck has been cleared with Litton, could this enhance Locksley's interest in the Herd, and could that interest further be enhanced if his juco coach is hired? Just wondering, I have no inside scoop.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/high-school/varsity-letters/bs-sp-kai-locksley-gilman-texas-iowa-western-20180109-story.html
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Chase an NFL QB? LOL
People are missing the most telling thing that will make Chase fail. He plays soft, can't run, and can't take an NFL hit. If he thought that Akron player rung his bell, NFL hits will really hurt him. He's gonna be on the turf saying; "Who dat? Who dare?" a lot.
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I hope the kid was smart enough to get his degree regardless of what chances myself or any other internet expert thinks he has.
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Come on back, fans; no excuse now.
I don't think the fans didn't buy tix because Chase was the QB. That's a stretch.
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Would be a good opportunity here for a Grad transfer QB.
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Is Eric Kresser available?
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I don't think the fans didn't buy tix because Chase was the QB. That's a stretch.
Fans bitched about Legg and Chase both, as I remember it. In the stands, they were all over him during games. I'm just saying that on offense there is a complete change-over; no excuses now for fans to stay away because of our offense. IMHO, you'd have to make up excuses now not to come back to the games next year if your a fan of Herd football.
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I would bet Chase did not want to leave Florida and come back to WV so I bet his friends and family during the break convinced him to try for the NFL and if it does not work out just finish college in Florida.
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LJ Chaney
@pacificscouting
Follow Follow @pacificscouting
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Marshall QB Chase Litton will sign w/ Steinberg Sports. Leigh really wanted him, so that's great news for Litton.
4:06 PM - 14 Jan 2018
4 Retweets 1 Like James KoutoulasZach LittonDevy Football FactoryDevy Watch Podcast
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Matthew Lawless
@Lawless2Lawless
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Replying to @pacificscouting
Surprised by the news today. Thought he had the chance to dramatically improve his stock next season in a weaker QB class. Still hoping for the best for him
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Walter football listed him 2-4 round projected with possibility of day 3. All depends on work outs now
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Good luck to Chase.
Personally, I think he is way too inconsistent to be an NFL QB.
I am much more pumped for the Isaiah Green era to begin than I would have been from another year of some great QB play here and there, but with quite a bit of bad in between.
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Greene is better than Kai Locksley are whoever is. Bring in a true freshman stud qb and let him and our current qb's battle it out. Build the next great Herd qb. If the OC is the right hire then we are fine with a young qb corp. Question is does Tyre Brady dip??
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Chase has the gold standard QB firm representing him, so someone believes.
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http://walterfootball.com/draft2018underclassmen.php
Chase gets an B, QB from Houston gets a F-.................
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Chase has the gold standard QB firm representing him, so someone believes.
Those firms and agents have nothing to lose and are hoping to hit a home when a player declares for the draft.
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Greene is better than Kai Locksley are whoever is. Bring in a true freshman stud qb and let him and our current qb's battle it out. Build the next great Herd qb. If the OC is the right hire then we are fine with a young qb corp. Question is does Tyre Brady dip??
If you don't even know who the kid is, how do you know Green is better? You can't know that until they're both battling it out in practice, IF KL even comes here. In another thread you said bring in the Martinsburg kid, now you say bring in a stud true Fr. Which do you want? Bagent would not be "stud QB" and idk if KL is better than Green, but I do know he'd be a better choice than Bagent. You contradict yourself too much.
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Because you keep doing the same things. You're doing it now and trying yet again to act like you're the victim. It's old. It's played. Don't keep saying "you're only discussing it via PM" , then just do it. Quit going back and forth over nothing, hijacking threads and then acting like you've done nothing wrong.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/JNILtQTejmEg0/giphy.gif)
Wait.
Did you just make yourself out to be the victim by complaining that someone else is playing the victim? I think you did.
Mental, yes, and yet oh so clever.
You saw that people were figuring you out, just as I said they had last night... so?... soooo, you upped your game.
I'm impressed.
But it gets better...
Did you just assist in hijacking a thread to talk about someone else hijacking a thread?
Whoa. I'm in awe of the genius.
And the icing on the top.. did you just cry out that someone wasn't using PMs to discuss what rightfully should be discussed by PM by NOT using a PM?
(http://www.gifcrap.com/g2data/albums/TV/Wayne_s%20World%20-%20We_re%20not%20worthy.gif)
How very Lucy-like of you. How very Charlie Brownish of me. But I'm doing the Roger Daltrey thing now, and we won't be fooled again. Gave you a good faith chance for a good faith PM discussion, and clearly your motives are something different than good faith at this point.
And/but, speaking of doing what you say you're going to do, I think you're on maybe your 57th time saying you had firmly decided to just not engage my posts.
Yet here you are.
Again.
The behavior speaks for itself. No additional descriptions or name calling necessary.
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EDIT: Nah, it doesn't work that way, Lucy. You don't do what you've done over the last 24 hours, and NOW decide you want to attempt a good faith PM discussion. Wasted your time trying. Not reading anything there, not reading anything more of yours here for awhile. Imposing on you a time out where I'm concerned, but good for you, there's all these other people here who are your buds who will always reassure you of your superiority. Chatter with them. I defend that by saying I've never sought out your posts looking for opportunity to crap on you in a personal way. My criticisms have always (because they are always anyhow) been directed at the content of what is said or how the content is presented... substance, not personal attack. I am neither superior nor inferior to you as a person, and so it's not even something that ever occurs to me to post about. Even though you occasionally do, indeed, post something substantive and worth discussing, I've lost any interest in engaging you. Supposedly, awhile back, you did with me, too... so call it even, and let's just agree to be disinterested and live up to that.
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Man PBIII what about the gun man on the "Grassy Knoll". I do like your thinking. Hopefully I will be back at the Cam for either one or both of our games on this next home stand. I am having problems getting my legs back under me. I guess that is what happens when you get past 65. Sub freezing weather makes it tough to get out and move around.
TRS
MU 71
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I don't think the fans didn't buy tix because Chase was the QB. That's a stretch.
To be fair, sv, I think the point is that the two primary targets of fan wrath are now out of the picture, and that for that population, it's safe to return to the Joan now.
Chase clearly had a close relationship with Legg, and vice-versa. Seems likely to me that he 90% had his mind made up from the moment he learned Legg was leaving.
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Given time to digest this, I think Chase probably made the right decision. There's a pretty good chance that every one of the top 10 QBs will end up either on a roster or on an NFL practice squad next fall, and Chase might as well be getting tutored by someone at that level as playing here.
Good luck to him. Even with the weird roller coaster relationship with many fans, it sounds like he's carrying his Marshall experience proudly.
Yes, he's got some maturing to do even yet, but that sooooo could have been said of me at that age, and I'm guessing a majority of folks here would acknowledge the same.
He's flashed enough to suggest he's physically capable. But now the tough part for practically every QB who aspires to get to the big time... can he improve his decision-making, and gain a much higher consistency and precision on his passes? Hope he can.
I for one hope he finds a team with a solid o-line. That's mandatory from where I sit if he's going to go on to bigger and better things.
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If you don't even know who the kid is, how do you know Green is better? You can't know that until they're both battling it out in practice, IF KL even comes here. In another thread you said bring in the Martinsburg kid, now you say bring in a stud true Fr. Which do you want? Bagent would not be "stud QB" and idk if KL is better than Green, but I do know he'd be a better choice than Bagent. You contradict yourself too much.
I know how bad he is that's why I forget. He's a qb that Texas wanted him to switch positions. Has texas had a good qb recently. No. Another guy thinking he's actually a good qb. Play youth. Play your roster and bring in another quality freshman. Juco kid comes in and is beat out they aren't sticking around. Greene would then dip. Bring in freshman studs. As for Bagent, kid be another Penny or be terrible. That's any player. The jr committed to us from St Albans based on his film looks to be better all around player than Bagent.
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I am totally neutral on this. On one hand it would have been nice having experience under center next year, but the games I have attended and others watched on television with Chase as QB were a complete downgrade from former QBs. With a new OC coming in, maybe this is the best time to throw a different player out there. Especially with the amount of veterans we have coming back next year. I don't think this will drastically cha he the outlook for next year, but it might. I think Litton should have raised his draft stock a bit because I can't see him being drafted this year. But hey, I've been wrong before.....I wish him well and thank him for the time he played for The Herd.
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We need to go the JC route next year.I see no way he is ready for the NFL. no OC ,now the news is looking worse.We need a miracle now that what looked to be a great season next year and this is going to hurt.Very depressing.
With the number of returning starters on offense next year, this is the ideal time to put a raw and talented kid at QB (Isaiah Green). The receiving Corp is going to have more experience and chemistry, the running game of King and Davis will be more consistent and the offensive line will be solid. Whoever the new OC is, I would imagine he will have a more expanded play book than Legg so a first year starter learning a new system that will probably mild around him to some extent will be great. As long as Green isn't garbage, we should be fine. (I'm assuming Green will be our man because Morrell hasn't shown me that he could complete a pass against a junior high team)
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Best of luck to Chase.
As far as that guy saying he could go in first round....please get me a case of whatever he is drinking.
Average college QBs rarely, if ever, develop into NFL caliber talent. I certainly give him credit for growing up a lot over the last year but racking up decent stats vs bad competition and having many fundamental flaws would be very tough to overcome. On top of my head issues:
- Accuracy. He is not very accurate and not very consistent.
- Product of a poor system. He will have a much tougher time adjusting to NFL game because of the simplistic nature of our offense at MU. He wasn't really asked to go through more than a 2 progression and wasn't asked to throw many of the routes and combos he would have to throw in NFL.
- Reacts poorly to pressure. His mechanics break down and he resorts to throwing off back foot etc.
Getting drafted as a marginal talent is very tricky. One reason is if any team thinks they can get you as a FA they will wait. FA is his most likely route unless NFL scouting depts are even worse than I already think. If he is leaving because he thinks it might hurt him to have to learn a new system next yr....wait until he gets a look at an NFL playbook.
I said last year Clark had a shot because he was so raw, had pretty decent speed for a big guy and you can't teach 6'7 with jumping ability. I think Legg has a better chance of landing at a P5 as a sole OC than CL getting drafted in top 3 rounds and i'd put BL chances of that at less than 5%.
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Fans bitched about Legg and Chase both, as I remember it. In the stands, they were all over him during games. I'm just saying that on offense there is a complete change-over; no excuses now for fans to stay away because of our offense. IMHO, you'd have to make up excuses now not to come back to the games next year if your a fan of Herd football.
I partially disagree with that. I think most fans who already have season tix and live close by would be renewing at thought of BL not returning. I think many other marginal fans and those living farther away will wait until we see some tangible results.
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Best of luck to Chase.
As far as that guy saying he could go in first round....please get me a case of whatever he is drinking.
The exact quote was "Think he had a real shot to be a riser in the 2019 draft, potentially as a first rounder."
If, as we've seen today, the player is showing up in some scouts' top 10 QBs as-is for the 2018 draft, it seems pretty likely if only because the QB inventory would evaporate and he would be among only a few remaining, that he would have went into 2018 at or near the top of some boards for the position. And further, remember that QB is a position that teams will reach for a player more than any other.
So, imagining an ideal year where the offensive starters mostly stayed healthy and did in every game what it flashed this past season, and Chase gained consistency that on occasion we see QBs do in their senior seasons, and further, imagining the big season that several on this forum had been predicting... in combination with a lack of competition from very many other QBs worth taking... in combination with teams desperate for QB talent and ready to reach...
Yeah, it's at least conceivable. No, not likely. But to be fair to the scout, that's in the ballpark of what he said... "a shot at being a real riser"... and then, best-case, "potentially a first rounder."
I'm not anyone but an amateur draft-nik, like many, and fwiw, I would feel comfortable thinking Chase would have rated a 3rd-4th round grade, and thus, a team might reach for him in the 2nd, again depending on what the rest of the QB inventory looked like.
FA is his most likely route
Agreed, almost certainly so, but he could sneak into a late round. It's not sounding like a great year for QBs. No one anyone is gaga about taking in the 1st round even.
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I personally wish Chase the best for his career. And thank him for his time here.
I think he has great talent.
Was looking forward to his senior season with a new OC but the decision to make is his.
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When it is so easy to just wait and see how he does, I don't get wanting to put yourself out there now, one way or another, only to be exposed as having no special skills at rating QB talent after all. Really, if you don't like him, you can revel is his failure later if that happens. If you predict he will be a flop and he turns out not to be, why look clueless. He did not endear himself to the fan base, but not every athlete does. Coaching leadership, or lack thereof, is significantly responsible for the overall tone and character of the team and players. There can be some responsibility reasonably spread for those in charge of guiding his character and leadership skills. It is not uncommon to have tremendous talent in a corporate environment that is unable to execute that talent because of the clueless leadership that has created losing strategies and failure tactics.
No matter what he might be that bothers fans, Chase is not the reason we do not have championships. I wish him well. I would not want to play in the system he played in, with the leadership he had. Time to move on and hope for better days all the way around.
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NBC Sports mention of Chase.
http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/01/14/surprise-marshall-qb-chase-litton-declares-for-nfl-draft/
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My advice would have been for Chase to stay at Marshall another season. 2018 can be a 10+ win season, and it gets him another year removed from the 3-9 year with the off-field behavior rumors. Chase made some progress in playing tougher and running the ball, but he still has a way to go in both categories. Would have given him another year to work on his throwing mechanics, and to get even bigger, stronger, and a little quicker. Sounds like he has an agent, so too late to change his mind. He's a long shot now, but you never know. Michael Clark surprised many of us when he made it to the NFL. Good luck to Chase and next QB up!
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Fans bitched about Legg and Chase both, as I remember it. In the stands, they were all over him during games. I'm just saying that on offense there is a complete change-over; no excuses now for fans to stay away because of our offense. IMHO, you'd have to make up excuses now not to come back to the games next year if your a fan of Herd football.
They may have stayed away because of Legg and the offense, but not because of some kid being the QB. Come on, that's a stretch.
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I do not want Chase or anybody else to fail that went to Marshall but he has very little chance of being drafted and developing as an NFL caliber QB if you look historically at average college QB's. Most of the blog writers and pundits have no idea and most are passing along 2nd hand information they read on other sites. The majority of NFL scouting departments are a joke IMO. They spend virtually all of their time on guys they will draft in first 2-3 rounds, rely on contracted scouts vs FT employees in many cases. It is why the majority of NFL teams can't keep up with the Patriots. The Patriots, for the most part, deemphasize the draft and focus more on finding players that fit their system. They know the draft is a crapshoot at best.
I just hate to see a guy like Chase who could have really benefited from staying imo getting information that leads him into a decision that may very well not be in his best interest. On other hand, he is pursuing his dreams and I hope and pray he beats the odds. For the record, I think Rosen and Darnold are good college QB's but I do not think either are elite by any stretch and it reflects the anchoring/confirmation bias that exists. For example, I have heard time after time how accurate Rosen is etc by all the tv talking heads yet:
- Rosen has never a year at UCLA (3 seasons) where he has completed more than 62.5%
- In 2017 he only had 3 games in 11 starts where he completed more than 62%. Many of his completion stats came from those 3 games...like 88% vs a bad Hawaii team and 72% vs a Cal team that only won 2 PAC12 games. He had 4 straight PAC12 games under 60% and in many games UCLA was behind allowing him to play vs softer coverage.
- Scouts/pundits talk about value of playing in Pac12. Not really a defensive league except Washington yet Rosen only had a 13/8 TD/Int ratio in 2017 in Pac12 play. Jarrod Goff by comparison had a 28/11 PAC12 ratio his last yr and that included a 5 int game vs Utah
- His big stat lines were padded by throwing at least 45 times in 6 of 11 games
- He has been hurt and missed games multiple times in college
- He is from a wealthy family and doesn't need to be hungry for success
Now this doesn't mean Rosen won't be successful, but does it sound to you like a franchise QB that is a lock for success and worth staking your future on that all these pundits are leading people to believe??
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I just hate to see a guy like Chase who could have really benefited from staying imo getting information that leads him into a decision that may very well not be in his best interest. On other hand, he is pursuing his dreams and I hope and pray he beats the odds.
Prompts me to ask...
1. How confident are you that he will or will not make an NFL practice squad for 2018?
2. Assuming he makes a practice squad, handicap please the value of him getting coaching at that level versus getting another year here.
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Prompts me to ask...
1. How confident are you that he will or will not make an NFL practice squad for 2018?
2. Assuming he makes a practice squad, handicap please the value of him getting coaching at that level versus getting another year here.
Couldn't Chase have still have tried these things next year if he stayed at MU? The advantage of him staying was to get more experience at the college level, and possibly improve any draft possibilities or NFL opportunities. Chase's biggest issue is taking hits. Another year at MU would have gotten him bigger & stronger, and more experienced at taking hits. Right now, he could possibly make all the QB throws, but if he shows the timidness and hurried decisions when he's being rushed it could be a very short camp for him.
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He could have improved draft stock next season if he started. I've been told the Greene kid is good really good. Litton gets benched or beat out he slips off the board perhaps. Biggest knock like Quickstrike said is taking hits and not being scared of them. But character concerns will pop up in his draft interviews. He's got a long way to go. But I'm pulling for him. Buffalo Bills!
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Prompts me to ask...
1. How confident are you that he will or will not make an NFL practice squad for 2018?
2. Assuming he makes a practice squad, handicap please the value of him getting coaching at that level versus getting another year here.
As of now only about 10 NFL teams have a QB on their practice squad (you are allowed 10 players). Why? Because most carry 3 QB on active roster. Most practice squad are heavy on guys who can also play special teams (DB, RB, LB, TE) and some OL. You'd have to really like a QB to keep him on practice squad and/or have depth/injury issues. So while it's hard to handicap his chances, the numbers say the chance of making a practice squad as a QB are not great. WKY ex-QB Doughty currently on a practice squad as is Kellen Moore from Boise St. How he performs in any actual team workouts/camps could go a long way but that doesn't give him much time as those things start soon after draft.
Assuming he was lucky enough to make a practice squad, it would help him immensely as it would give him lots of time with other QB's etc. As far as tutelage goes, he will not see the one on one work that other QB's get with the QB coach but how he picks up playbook etc etc could really help him and not being in school would allow him to focus 100% on football. But practice squads in season usually have lots of fluctuation depending on injuries etc. He could be on right path and boom he is gone for a more immediate need and that's a difficult life. On flip side, QB's in particular, at all levels, need game reps at game speed to get better and is why most NFL 2nd string QB are not young guys but guys who have game experience. As lousy as MU's offensive system is/was he would get benefit of game snaps over a 13 or so game season in college vs zero game snaps in NFL unless he ascended to #1 on active roster or played well enough to get some reps in preseason games. You can practice your jumpshot all day but until you are doing it in game vs a defense and real competition you just don't know how much it translates to on field success.
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Chris your points on Rosen and Darnold the reason teams are putting them so high is because they come from pro ish style offenses. Day one you’re going to get someone comfortable under Center. Teams are starting to realize these college systems are producing crap shoot results.
Few things for Chase. His tape wasn’t going to get any better. For those saying oh his stock would have improved, unless your name is Luck your stock as a QB will hurt. Matt Barkley , Connor Cook were guys who waited a year and went from 1st round to 4th. Chases mechanics are not good for tape.
Heck, let’s compare Josh Allen. Josh is 6’5 230 big arm. (Sound familiar?) was terrible against P5 but good against less completion. Wasn’t top 5 in conference. Last year he leaves, he’s top 15. This year they are saying late 1st round. His numbers are worse than Chases. Josh knew staying another year further hurts his stock. Chase is like a Cardale Jones. A big dude, with a big arm. Remember Cardale got drafted off 6 games starting? Maybe less. Why? Big dude big arm and some team thought they could teach him. We are looking way too deep at his flaws and not enough at what the NFL is wanting. Also sounds like Steinberg really wanted him. I trust Leigh. He will get him with a team.
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As of now only about 10 NFL teams have a QB on their practice squad (you are allowed 10 players). Why? Because most carry 3 QB on active roster. Most practice squad are heavy on guys who can also play special teams (DB, RB, LB, TE) and some OL. You'd have to really like a QB to keep him on practice squad and/or have depth/injury issues. So while it's hard to handicap his chances, the numbers say the chance of making a practice squad as a QB are not great. WKY ex-QB Doughty currently on a practice squad as is Kellen Moore from Boise St. How he performs in any actual team workouts/camps could go a long way but that doesn't give him much time as those things start soon after draft.
Assuming he was lucky enough to make a practice squad, it would help him immensely as it would give him lots of time with other QB's etc. As far as tutelage goes, he will not see the one on one work that other QB's get with the QB coach but how he picks up playbook etc etc could really help him and not being in school would allow him to focus 100% on football. But practice squads in season usually have lots of fluctuation depending on injuries etc. He could be on right path and boom he is gone for a more immediate need and that's a difficult life. On flip side, QB's in particular, at all levels, need game reps at game speed to get better and is why most NFL 2nd string QB are not young guys but guys who have game experience. As lousy as MU's offensive system is/was he would get benefit of game snaps over a 13 or so game season in college vs zero game snaps in NFL unless he ascended to #1 on active roster or played well enough to get some reps in preseason games. You can practice your jumpshot all day but until you are doing it in game vs a defense and real competition you just don't know how much it translates to on field success.
For now, at least until the combines, Chase appears to be getting ranked in the 8-9 range.
# of QBs drafted in 2015 = 7
# of QBs drafted in 2016 = 15
# of QBs drafted in 2017 = 10
Last QB drafted in 2015 = Trevor Seimien, Broncos, active
Last QB drafted in 2016 = Brandon Doughty, Dolphins, spent season on practice squad
Last QB drafted in 2017 = Chad Kelly, Broncos, injured reserve
To think he won't make a practice squad at least seems to be a stretch, to me at least.
Would agree, as has been pointed out, there's value to real game action, and he could have benefited from that.
And of course, have to agree, as has also been pointed out, there's risk to real game action, too.
Who knows how things would have played out... maybe Chase takes a big jump in development as a senior, and he vaults into the top 5 QBs for 2019... maybe he suffers an MCL tear, and his stock suffers.
We just don't know. It's that do you want to take the bird in the hand, or the two in the bush kind-of thing. Conservatives like me think the bird in the hand ain't so bad, but I can't deny the two in the bush is completely reasonable.
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Chris your points on Rosen and Darnold the reason teams are putting them so high is because they come from pro ish style offenses. Day one you’re going to get someone comfortable under Center. Teams are starting to realize these college systems are producing crap shoot results.
Few things for Chase. His tape wasn’t going to get any better. For those saying oh his stock would have improved, unless your name is Luck your stock as a QB will hurt. Matt Barkley , Connor Cook were guys who waited a year and went from 1st round to 4th. Chases mechanics are not good for tape.
1. Do we know what style offense we're running in 2018? I missed that announcement. I thought at least one of the OC's supposedly on the list does, in fact, have a history of running a pro-style.
2. Being mortal sucks. Because we're all mortal, we can't say with any certainty that we know whether his tape was going to get any better.
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1. Do we know what style offense we're running in 2018? I missed that announcement. I thought at least one of the OC's supposedly on the list does, in fact, have a history of running a pro-style.
2. Being mortal sucks. Because we're all mortal, we can't say with any certainty that we know whether his tape was going to get any better.
Sturt seniors are known to get picked apart on film. Again see Barkley and Cook as examples of how that fails. Both came from Pro Style systems. His senior tape is going to be graded differently. He’s going to be expected to make reads, footwork, arm position all had to be better.
Ryan Tannehill is the example I use always for intrigue on QBs. Tannehill was 6’4 played WR fully but his last year. His size, speed etc created intrigue. Limited tape created potential teams saw. So he goes top 10, proven Russ Wilson goes 3rd round because he’s 6’. To that same we could use Mike Glennon who forced Wilson out of NC St. out of college was drafted 3rd round. Was very average but big arm, big body at 6’6. Backs up at Tampa and Chicago hands him a nice contract. Why? Again because of size and intrigue.
I don’t agree with how QBs are evaluated next level but it is what it is. The NFL formula is pretty tried and true.
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Sturt seniors are known to get picked apart on film. Again see Barkley and Cook as examples of how that fails. Both came from Pro Style systems. His senior tape is going to be graded differently. He’s going to be expected to make reads, footwork, arm position all had to be better.
Ryan Tannehill is the example I use always for intrigue on QBs. Tannehill was 6’4 played WR fully but his last year. His size, speed etc created intrigue. Limited tape created potential teams saw. So he goes top 10, proven Russ Wilson goes 3rd round because he’s 6’. To that same we could use Mike Glennon who forced Wilson out of NC St. out of college was drafted 3rd round. Was very average but big arm, big body at 6’6. Backs up at Tampa and Chicago hands him a nice contract. Why? Again because of size and intrigue.
I don’t agree with how QBs are evaluated next level but it is what it is. The NFL formula is pretty tried and true.
So, you've picked out a few anecdotal examples as support. Seems reasonable.
Is that to say someone taking the opposite position cannot do the same?
(It's a question. I've not researched it b/c it's just not risen to any level of priority for me. But for all I know, you've researched this so much that, indeed, you know someone cannot do the same.)
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We once had a back-up QB go get some strong consideration in Seattle as a FA... what was his name?
Derek Devine
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He could have improved draft stock next season if he started. I've been told the Greene kid is good really good. Litton gets benched or beat out he slips off the board perhaps. Biggest knock like Quickstrike said is taking hits and not being scared of them. But character concerns will pop up in his draft interviews. He's got a long way to go. But I'm pulling for him. Buffalo Bills!
To me this is the biggest reason he left. With a new OC coming, I don't believe his QB1 status was a lock. Green got QB1 reps for a portion of spring ball last year. Let's say we go with a heavy QB run offense and Green fits better, what does his draft stock look like after being benched for a RS Freshman at a mid major? Some might say that's a long shot cause be started 3 years, but if you believe what Doc says then the best man gets on the field. I do believe Doc has shown that can happen to seniors.
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To me this is the biggest reason he left. With a new OC coming, I don't believe his QB1 status was a lock. Green got QB1 reps for a portion of spring ball last year. Let's say we go with a heavy QB run offense and Green fits better, what does his draft stock look like after being benched for a RS Freshman at a mid major? Some might say that's a long shot cause be started 3 years, but if you believe what Doc says then the best man gets on the field. I do believe Doc has shown that can happen to seniors.
If there was any chance that a RS Fr could beat Chase out after him starting for 3 years do you really think he would have any chance in hell of making any money at all from an NFL team?
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Nobody knows for sure and all good points. And true, pro style offense guys get benefit of doubt more than others. NFL personnel depts do a lot of dumb things in taking some and not taking others imo. Chase is not Brandon Doughty. Chase has a shot but it is a long one...much longer than Wr Clarke imo.
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If there was any chance that a RS Fr could beat Chase out after him starting for 3 years do you really think he would have any chance in hell of making any money at all from an NFL team?
I don't think it would be about Litton not being talented enough to play. I'm saying a total change of offensive strategy. You think Litton could start for a Rich Rod coached team or Navy, for example? Don't think so. Not a knock on him, just doesn't fit.
If there is even a 5% chance that could happen and you think you can get drafted now, why wait and risk it?
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I am really confused why some are faulting the kid for leaving. Majority of you wanted him on the bench anyway and figured Greene would beat him out. He might as well leave and get good training and maybe develop into a NFL QB. I know I am not going to speculate on here whether he does or does not make it. I am an accountant not a scout. It is his choice and I hope he make it but it isn’t my opinion to say he is stupid. I don’t think it was the right decision but there could be a lot of stuff none of us on here know about. With a new OC coming he may not have fit into the plans so why not move on. Sitting the bench would not have changed anything.
As someone that gave it all for a The Herd I will be rooting hard for him to be successful and won’t be negative about it. I want him to make it an be another NFL QB from Marshall and prove a lot of people wrong.
Now what I am afraid is going to happen is all those that didn’t like him will really miss him next year should the freshman come out struggling and we don’t do as well as we should next year due to QB play.
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That's sort of an urban legend among herd fans. Derek Devine was a good kid and went to a few camps as a thrower, but I don't think ever had any serious consideration as a QB at a professional level, even CFL. His family was connected and he was happy enough to spend the summer on the roster. Got in a couple of preseason games with the Redskins. Some posters would try to use it as an argument of the quality of our bench players, the incorrectness of starting some other quarterback or some such nonsense. There's no denying he was on some NFL trading rosters, he never had a real opportunity to make any roster.
bbcard1, ever see pictures of Devine's girlfriend, possibly now wife? If so, then you'd probably know why he wouldn't have the time necessary to seriously entertain being a professional QB!! ;)